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Post by Hawksfan10 on Feb 20, 2018 16:11:04 GMT
I'm no Bowman defender, but criticizing the Saad for Panarin trade in complete hindsight is wrong. And I'd still prefer Saad over one-dimensional softie--who has as many goals as the Hawks' captain (who is having his worst offensive NHL season).
The rest is pretty much correct.
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Post by khawk20 on Feb 20, 2018 16:28:58 GMT
Saad for Panarin just hurts more because Forsberg has turned out to be "meh" as a backup.
Thrust into the same position with the same lousy team in front of him, A lot of other backups would be failing too. But personally I was used to guys like Emery and Darling stepping up when needed.
They of course had much better teams in front of them.
And, I am not sure either one could have turned the fortunes of this version of the team around, although I suspect the Hawks would have a few more wins since less ridiculous goals...backbreakers to a fragile team psyche...would have gone in than have on Forsberg and Glass.
I (and I think most of us) hoped that Forsberg would have been a Darling type of story. He isn't. So when someone touted as a decent piece of a big trade isn't what you hoped, it makes that trade seem that much worse.
Saad having a lousy season hurts obviously, but it would hurt less if Forsberg filled Crows spot better.
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Post by Hawksfan10 on Feb 20, 2018 16:47:07 GMT
Saad has underachieved. Does anyone think Panarin's presence has the team in the playoffs with the same shitty goaltending and being that much softer?
I fully believe Saad will bounce back as well.
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Post by markwojo on Feb 20, 2018 17:08:30 GMT
Saad verses Panarin is the least of this teams problems. The reality is we never won squat with Panarin (or Anisimov) here. Panarin in a comparison of this and next season is probably a better asset when looking at 6 million verse 6 million. The comparison for the next 2 seasons after next when Saad is at 6 and Panarin probably closer to 8 (for a longer commitment) will likely favor the team that has the guy that is a year younger.
Panarin's track record has been a 70-75 point guy that adds little beyond the points. His current pace is more along the lines of 60-65 points and maybe an off year or it may be what some suspected (that he is a very good player regardless, but playing with Kane helped him (and both of them) some). Saad's track record is a 50-55 point guy that offers quite a bit outside of just the points. He is on a 40-45 point pace which is certainly not enough to earn 6 million regardless of the other stuff he brings. Saad has a 4 year track record of being a 50-55 point guy with 2 different teams for 2 years each. Panarin had 2 years playing with Kane to hit his levels. The odds of Saad being what he has been prior are pretty good. Forsberg seemed like a decent risk to be a solid #2 to cover the difference in value the first couple years (before Panarin gets paid more...probably somewhere other then Chicago). I'll take DeBrincat in the Panarin role (and that kid seems like he might actually do something productive besides just points which I have never gotten the inkling you will see from Panarin.
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Post by khawk20 on Feb 20, 2018 17:19:54 GMT
Saad has underachieved. Does anyone think Panarin's presence has the team in the playoffs with the same shitty goaltending and being that much softer? I don't, but I do think that Kane and Panarin would be doing better as a tandem than Saad-Toews has, which probably would have translated into a few more wins here and there. Panini's one timer was a thing of beauty too, a real weapon with Kane (and others) feeding him.
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Post by lari on Feb 20, 2018 17:47:14 GMT
Saad for Panarin just hurts more because Forsberg has turned out to be "meh" as a backup. If Forsberg was not included in the trade, hypothetically the Hawks would have started the season with JF Huet as their backup, and Glass as #3. Hawks would have a couple points less right now.
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Post by khawk20 on Feb 20, 2018 17:59:27 GMT
Was not a commentary on getting him, more a comment on having a certain level of expectation with the backups of recent years.
If Forsberg is more than "meh", then "at least Forsberg is turning out ok" would be something that could be reasonably thrown out there.
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Post by Hawksfan10 on Feb 20, 2018 18:09:37 GMT
This team's goaltending is in serious trouble if that's all the have to offer when Crawford goes down.
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Post by garyu on Feb 20, 2018 18:10:41 GMT
Saad for Panarin just hurts more because Forsberg has turned out to be "meh" as a backup. If Forsberg was not included in the trade, hypothetically the Hawks would have started the season with JF Huet as their backup, and Glass as #3. Hawks would have a couple points less right now. If no Forsberg, perhaps it would've forced Stan to get an actual NHL goalie as backup?
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Post by lari on Feb 20, 2018 18:35:15 GMT
If Forsberg was not included in the trade, hypothetically the Hawks would have started the season with JF Huet as their backup, and Glass as #3. Hawks would have a couple points less right now. If no Forsberg, perhaps it would've forced Stan to get an actual NHL goalie as backup? For a large amount of money, no doubt.
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Post by jimc on Feb 20, 2018 18:50:09 GMT
Forsberg fucking sucks...he is absolutely among the top 5 worst B/U g's in the league.
Hawk PP has taken it in the ass w/o Panarin...both Kane and Panarin have seen their pts and goal totals fall w/o each other.
Both Saad snd Tor es have SUCKED this year...mostly together. Seems Saad was more a product of healthy Hossa and Jonny. Saad has been pretty useless at everything this year...he is not excelling as an elite checking F, PK'er, or anything. Hawks lost that trade, based on this season so far. Saad replaces Hossa but is a downgrade...he does nothing to replace Panarin. ADB wasnt part of the trade...he fills in some of the missing offense of Panarin, but not nearly enough...and is even more if a 1 dimensional liability...but is very young and cost effective.
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Post by lari on Feb 20, 2018 19:27:09 GMT
Saad has potential to do better, but he needs a wake-up call. He shouldn't settle for what he does now. He could still be a legit top line NHLer, but that means playing every week at the level he did in October.
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Post by soccer24 on Feb 20, 2018 19:50:47 GMT
Saad did fine in Columbus away from Hossa and Toews.
Saying he was just a product of those two is awfully inaccurate. He's having a bad year, no doubt. He seems like someone who will turn it around.
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Post by garyu on Feb 20, 2018 19:58:05 GMT
Saad did fine in Columbus away from Hossa and Toews. Saying he was just a product of those two is awfully inaccurate. He's having a bad year, no doubt. He seems like someone who will turn it around. Agreed, it doesn't look like he quit working. Just can't find his ass with both hands.
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Post by Hawksfan10 on Feb 20, 2018 20:31:43 GMT
In February, Kaner has 5 pts in 10 games and is -10. He's skating with anchors too, but still...
Whomever the next coach is really needs to load up JT/PK and let the rest figure itself out.
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